The Energetic Properties of Surrender

////The Energetic Properties of Surrender

This topic contains 21 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  Menas Kafatos 3 years ago.

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  • #4985 Score: 1

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    My question stems from the larger question regarding “power”. In other words, what moves things forward? Specifically, in regards to the characteristic of sub-atomic particles and how they shift to wave form when not being observed: this feels very similar to the principle of “non-attachment” or surrender in regards to manifestation. So the question is this: is surrender an empowering act because in a way we are ceasing to observe the outcome of our desires and thus shifting them (energetically) from particle to wave?

    This post has received 1 vote up.
  • #5169 Score: 0

    Aurora Carlson
    Keymaster
    110 votes
    @aurorac

    Hi Seth! I absolutely love your question. You know, it made me think that there are questions which come from understanding. This feels like that πŸ™‚
    Would you like to share a little about the experiences which have led to this clarifying question? To me, it is very clear that if I don’t let go of my ego attachment to an outcome, I am actually blocking myself (the infinite self) from moving freely and intelligently. Have you had similar experiences?

  • #5179 Score: 1

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    Thanks for the reply Aurora. πŸ™‚

    As far as experience goes, I’m absolutely encountering this truth. For me, the process of being able to release and surrender the outcomes of my intentions has involved a great deal of “shadow work” – moving and transmuting trapped traumatic (low-vibe) energy in my body. That has created permanent shifts in me and manifestation has begun to flow more freely. But it has made me very curious as to the particle/wave relationship in this principle. For instance, Carl Jung said that “unless we do the work of bringing the unconscious into the conscious, it will dictate your life and you’ll call it fate.” Does that mean that the behavior of the particles (the trauma-energy) is “unobservable” until it is brought into the conscious realm and therefore remains trapped in a particle state? Is it then our goal to live in a “wave-state”, as it were?

    I hope this makes sense. I have gone about my own transformation with an “experience first, understand later” approach, which has worked….. now I’m writing and teaching and searching for new language to describe these things. Thanks for responding. πŸ™‚

    This post has received 1 vote up.
    • #5180 Score: 1

      Aurora Carlson
      Keymaster
      110 votes
      @aurorac

      Oh yes, it makes complete sense πŸ™‚

      For me, the process of being able to release and surrender the outcomes of my intentions has involved a great deal of β€œshadow work” – moving and transmuting trapped traumatic (low-vibe) energy in my body. That has created permanent shifts in me and manifestation has begun to flow more freely.

      I call these “knots” and I too have discovered how to dissolve them in what can be called “me” as well as “others”. I see them as energy/information which is meant to flow freely but has become stuck, frozen, through some kind of trauma. Yes, I guess you can call this trauma energy unconscious, meaning that there are patterns we repeat without realizing they are patterns, and that there actually is a free choice there under it all. It can be anything really… things most of us would want to let go of like angry responses or emotional pain in certain situations, but it is much more to a yogi… gravitation, becoming cold in winter πŸ™‚ Any habit of experience that we take for granted, any experience which is so strong or convincing that it makes the creating self forget itself as creator and lose itself in the creation.

      I too have experience as my guide and Deepak has been such a light in helping me understand what I have found out. It will be so interesting to see what he says about this. But tell me Seth, how do you teach your discoveries to others, would you like to share a little about that?

      This post has received 1 vote up.
  • #5181 Score: 2

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    Thanks Aurora – very helpful. πŸ™‚ I hope Deepak is able to comment on this… would love to hear his insights.

    As far as my work goes, I am coming from the Christian tradition – out of the Evangelical Church and into Christian Mysticism through the kind of healing you described. As far as my work goes, I wrote a book and created a brand around that book that is trying to wake up the Christian world from which I was birthed. (www.mypilgrimage.com) That has had it’s challenges of course, but has been wonderful in so many ways. I also started a business (www.intrsect.us) that is trying to wake up large corporations in custom built therapeutic ways. I write and speak’n’stuff. πŸ™‚ (www.sethtalantaylor.com). Blessings Aurora, your work is incredible. πŸ™‚

    This post has received 2 votes up.
    • #5183 Score: 0

      Aurora Carlson
      Keymaster
      110 votes
      @aurorac

      Great work, Seth, thanks so much for sharing! From wherever we are, we need to do the work and then share it with those whose language we understand best. Have you read any of the books written by Deepak on Jesus? I think he has written two, and I found them both so amazing, They have been of great help to me in dialogues with people coming from the Christian tradition.

  • #5187 Score: 1

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    Yeah – I read several of them. My life seems to be a study of reinterpretation of my Christian upbringing. Grateful for it though – there is such a need in that space to be woken up. πŸ™‚

    This post has received 1 vote up.
  • #5327 Score: 0

    Deepak Chopra
    Moderator
    60 votes
    @deepakchopra

    Dear Seth,

    Thank you for your question! I am answering in Readers Ask: Is Non-Attachment the Key to Fulfillment of Worthy Goals?
    Would love to know what you think!

    Love,
    Deepak

  • #5329 Score: 1

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    Deepak,

    I am so incredibly grateful for your response. It’s extremely helpful for me in this chapter of my life where I am realizing finally what it means to desire beyond ego. Blessings and thank you again. πŸ™‚

    Seth

    This post has received 1 vote up.
  • #5330 Score: 1

    Root
    Participant
    2 votes
    @root

    Could we use the idea that “self power” behaves as a wave function and once we put our intention on it can manifest as a particle?

    This post has received 1 vote up.
    • #5346 Score: 0

      Aurora Carlson
      Keymaster
      110 votes
      @aurorac

      Root, I agree with you and @seth as long as we remember that consciousness, the self, is neither wave nor particle, but that which contains both (possibility and actuality). Its power would be choice (= attention & intention), through which possibilities become actualities. But I’m not even sure power is the right word, as this is simply the natural behavior of consciousness in manifesting the world. I mean… does it take “power” to manifest a flower, or a galaxy, in consciousness?

    • #6143 Score: 0

      Deepak Chopra
      Moderator
      60 votes
      @deepakchopra

      Dear @root, thank you for the question! I have answered in Readers Ask: What is Self Power?

      Love,
      Deepak

  • #5332 Score: 1

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    That’s I was thinking Root – that thus field of pure potentiality is a wave and when manifestation occurs, it is particle form….

    This post has received 1 vote up.
  • #5365 Score: 1

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    Aurora – absolutely. I’m finding it more and more fascinating that the mystery of creation is powerfully ongoing every moment of existence in this pregnant space of emptiness…the reason I use the word “power” is because what we’re essentially talking about is something that is always moving everything forward. It’s a way of naming the motion of it all…. and a way of addressing the powerlessness we experience from day to day in so many of our religious and business practices. The “powerlessness” of the idol in contrast to the alive and vibrant power of consciousness. πŸ™‚

    This post has received 1 vote up.
    • #5366 Score: 1

      Aurora Carlson
      Keymaster
      110 votes
      @aurorac

      Hey Seth, you have such a great way of putting things! πŸ™‚ Of course I know that power, in the yogic tradition it is referred to as “Shakti”. Power or simply emanation… it is always moving from the non-manifest to the manifest, but also, as you say, it is moving things forward, meaning that there obviously is evolution. Evolution of what? Here too, people will give different answers, some pointing to the evolution of species (matter), some to the evolution of species of consciousness as I’ve heard Deepak call it.

      I too think that the powerlessness at the base of the whole structure of our present civilization has to be questioned by those who have realized its unreality. So glad that we have all gathered here on YATU, people like yourself, @erik , @jenniferl , @robin , @paul , @kalkin and everyone else, to affirm a deeper truth!

      This post has received 1 vote up.
  • #5393 Score: 2

    Robin
    Participant
    51 votes
    @robin

    Thanks for bringing me to this discussion, @aurorac. Your mention of “emanation” reminds me of similar wisdom derived from the study of Kabbalah:
    EMANATION, a theory describing the origin of the material universe from a transcendent first principle. According to this theory, the universe, which is multiple, is generated from the One, which is unitary, through the medium of a hierarchy of immaterial substances. The ultimate source is undiminished, while the beings which are emanated are progressively less perfect as they are further removed from the first principle. The process is conceived as being atemporal.http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/emanation

    Sounds familiar, does it not? So the wisdom of #YATU is ancient and fundamental–found across religious and spiritual traditions. Could it be that the “we” who are “in time” at present have forgotten this knowledge? Or has it been repressed for some reason by those who fear its power, delivered into the hearts of all who dwell on Earth, might deprive those who would “lord” power over us with earthly power structures and appealing to the fear-based reality of the ego-mind?

    As I write this, it strikes me how the language of the Old Testament (and presumably the New Testament, although I am less familiar) actually sets up these power structures. After all, Who is Lord? Is that found only in God, or in the “I am” that is the indwelling spirit?

    IDK, language is so limiting, but it mimics the Ultimate and is derived from the Ein Sof in the best way we humans can emulate it, I guess.

    What do you all think?

    This post has received 2 votes up.
    • #5494 Score: 0

      Aurora Carlson
      Keymaster
      110 votes
      @aurorac

      Yes Robin, I too think that this (self)knowledge is inherent in people and has been forgotten by many. But whenever I worry about those who have forgotten and who cling to a self-ignorant point of view, reinforcing it again and again on our planet … I remember that they too are in consciousness. So instead of further constructing them that way, I see them transforming. It’s my movie and I’ll play if I want to, play if I want to, play if I want to… you would play too if it happened to youuuuuu! πŸ˜‰

  • #5410 Score: 0

    Menas Kafatos
    Moderator
    41 votes
    @menask

    Seth:

    You are bringing up and incredibly important point: Yes, surrender is power. But not the power of the ego. In truth, the ego is powerless. The universe is all power there is. Has anyone witnessed the tremendous power of the mighty ocean? Or the power of the 3 X 10^26 Watts of radiant energy from the Sun? Of course we have, countless beings have. How does the power of the ocean arise? The ocean surrenders to its own power. Being itself, “surrender” is really just “Being”.

    So if we go back to our true nature, just Being, then surrender is the same as being our true Nature. The issue of power and surrendering to the power is the perspective of the ego. Which after all, does not exist. This is the mystery!

  • #5412 Score: 0

    Seth
    Participant
    8 votes
    @seth

    Thank you for that response Menas. I will say I am fascinated in the ego’s role in transformation. I started my journey of transformation out of a desperation to end my suffering. My ego allowed me to run through walls to heal and change. I changed, but was exhausted. I was an ocean trying to arise. And then somehow it stopped and now I am learning to, as Deepak said, “do-be-do-be-do”. But I am grateful that my ego was there….and grateful that I now see the illusion.

  • #5682 Score: 0

    Sree
    Participant
    22 votes
    @sree

    Catching up here after a while… immensely grateful for this forum and all the contributors for bringing up such important topics and fascinating dialogue & insights.

  • #5692 Score: 0

    Menas Kafatos
    Moderator
    41 votes
    @menask

    Hi Seth:

    On your point about your ego: You do indeed have a higher understanding! The ego is useful to give us certain experiences, to get us to the point of moving to completeness. But most people get identified with the ego and they get stuck there. If, as you do, we take the ego as a tool and we are not attached to it, we can go beyond it.

    Love,

    Menas

  • #6584 Score: 0

    Menas Kafatos
    Moderator
    41 votes
    @menask

    Dear @root:

    Let me address your point:

    “Could we use the idea that β€œself power” behaves as a wave function and once we put our intention on it can manifest as a particle?”

    This is an interesting way to state it. Leaving aside what is meant by “self power” (all powers emanate from the Self, there are no separate powers), we could indeed state that all “powers” are potentially present and they manifest concretely when an observation takes place.

    Love and respect,

    Menas

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